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	<title>Comments on: Well worth the license fee</title>
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	<link>http://www.johnband.org/blog/2008/07/07/well-worth-the-license-fee/</link>
	<description>The idle musings of John B</description>
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		<title>By: Why is technology news not news? &#171; doctorvee</title>
		<link>http://www.johnband.org/blog/2008/07/07/well-worth-the-license-fee/comment-page-1/#comment-50428</link>
		<dc:creator>Why is technology news not news? &#171; doctorvee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jul 2008 16:05:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnband.org/blog/2008/07/07/well-worth-the-license-fee/#comment-50428</guid>
		<description>[...] Things don&#8217;t get much more ubiquitous than the internet. It is impossible to imagine that someone growing up today will not be a regular internet user in some form or another. And there are real dangers on the internet that aren&#8217;t to do with [say this like a caveman] &#8220;PEDOPHILS&#8221; and &#8220;CYBER BULLIES&#8221;. But the media reports on made-up dangers like &#8220;KNIVES&#8221; and &#8220;YOOFS&#8221; and &#8220;KNIVES&#8221; as though we are on the verge of bladeageddon. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Things don&#8217;t get much more ubiquitous than the internet. It is impossible to imagine that someone growing up today will not be a regular internet user in some form or another. And there are real dangers on the internet that aren&#8217;t to do with [say this like a caveman] &#8220;PEDOPHILS&#8221; and &#8220;CYBER BULLIES&#8221;. But the media reports on made-up dangers like &#8220;KNIVES&#8221; and &#8220;YOOFS&#8221; and &#8220;KNIVES&#8221; as though we are on the verge of bladeageddon. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: John B</title>
		<link>http://www.johnband.org/blog/2008/07/07/well-worth-the-license-fee/comment-page-1/#comment-49463</link>
		<dc:creator>John B</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jul 2008 12:10:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnband.org/blog/2008/07/07/well-worth-the-license-fee/#comment-49463</guid>
		<description>Look, I&#039;m talking in policymaking terms not &quot;how should individual criminals be treated&quot; terms here. Obviously when someone gets murdered that&#039;s a tragedy for them and their family, the murderer should be locked up for a long time, and both of these would be true even if they were the only person in the UK to be murdered. But if there were only one person murdered in the UK each year, then worrying about the impact of murder &lt;em&gt;on a policy level&lt;/em&gt; would be gibberingly insane.

I don&#039;t like the elevation of the Lawrence murder to totem status either - the important thing about that one from a policy perspective is not that some thugs killed a kid, but that the police investigated it badly because he was black, leading to the Macpherson report and some positive steps in making the police be less racist going forward.

To be honest, as someone who&#039;s been mugged, burgled and assaulted-occasioning-ABH before now (on separate occasions, to forestall any comedians), I&#039;m quite happy to state that all of these things have had a negligible effect on my life, beyond small amounts of pain or trauma and a day&#039;s worth of hassle sorting things out.

But I guess the only Victims Of Crime who get to have their opinions taken into account are the ones who advocate Hanging and Flogging, not the ones who point out that on a lot of occasions even crimes classed as serious (robbery, domestic burglary and ABH are certainly considered serious) are still mostly trivial and not worth getting too worked up about.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Look, I&#8217;m talking in policymaking terms not &#8220;how should individual criminals be treated&#8221; terms here. Obviously when someone gets murdered that&#8217;s a tragedy for them and their family, the murderer should be locked up for a long time, and both of these would be true even if they were the only person in the UK to be murdered. But if there were only one person murdered in the UK each year, then worrying about the impact of murder <em>on a policy level</em> would be gibberingly insane.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t like the elevation of the Lawrence murder to totem status either &#8211; the important thing about that one from a policy perspective is not that some thugs killed a kid, but that the police investigated it badly because he was black, leading to the Macpherson report and some positive steps in making the police be less racist going forward.</p>
<p>To be honest, as someone who&#8217;s been mugged, burgled and assaulted-occasioning-ABH before now (on separate occasions, to forestall any comedians), I&#8217;m quite happy to state that all of these things have had a negligible effect on my life, beyond small amounts of pain or trauma and a day&#8217;s worth of hassle sorting things out.</p>
<p>But I guess the only Victims Of Crime who get to have their opinions taken into account are the ones who advocate Hanging and Flogging, not the ones who point out that on a lot of occasions even crimes classed as serious (robbery, domestic burglary and ABH are certainly considered serious) are still mostly trivial and not worth getting too worked up about.</p>
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		<title>By: Ethan</title>
		<link>http://www.johnband.org/blog/2008/07/07/well-worth-the-license-fee/comment-page-1/#comment-49455</link>
		<dc:creator>Ethan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jul 2008 11:47:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnband.org/blog/2008/07/07/well-worth-the-license-fee/#comment-49455</guid>
		<description>Would you describe a woman being killed as a result of domestic violence as a &#039;non-event&#039;? Or rape? Or the death of Stephen Lawrence? I would hate to think you have wildly opposed sets of standards for crimes deemed appropriate objects of left-wing concern and those you consider right-wing territory.

Personally I think it&#039;s sick to describe any murder, even if it was the only in the country over the course of the whole year, as a &#039;non-event&#039;.

Your idea of the &#039;negligible impact of crime&#039; is utterly bizarre. Why don&#039;t you go and speak to actual victims of serious crime and tell them that the crime has had a &#039;negligible effect&#039; on their lives. Or do you think things only matter if they have a devastating impact on the lives of everyone in society &#039;en masse&#039;. If that&#039;s the case, then most of what we argue about in politics (including left-wing issues) is worth bothering about.

Also, the murders that make it into the news are generally the peaks of the iceburg of much more frequent low-level violence and &#039;anti-social behaviour&#039;. But if you think murders are &#039;non-events&#039; then I suppose you think muggings, assaults and harassment are childsplay.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Would you describe a woman being killed as a result of domestic violence as a &#8216;non-event&#8217;? Or rape? Or the death of Stephen Lawrence? I would hate to think you have wildly opposed sets of standards for crimes deemed appropriate objects of left-wing concern and those you consider right-wing territory.</p>
<p>Personally I think it&#8217;s sick to describe any murder, even if it was the only in the country over the course of the whole year, as a &#8216;non-event&#8217;.</p>
<p>Your idea of the &#8216;negligible impact of crime&#8217; is utterly bizarre. Why don&#8217;t you go and speak to actual victims of serious crime and tell them that the crime has had a &#8216;negligible effect&#8217; on their lives. Or do you think things only matter if they have a devastating impact on the lives of everyone in society &#8216;en masse&#8217;. If that&#8217;s the case, then most of what we argue about in politics (including left-wing issues) is worth bothering about.</p>
<p>Also, the murders that make it into the news are generally the peaks of the iceburg of much more frequent low-level violence and &#8216;anti-social behaviour&#8217;. But if you think murders are &#8216;non-events&#8217; then I suppose you think muggings, assaults and harassment are childsplay.</p>
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		<title>By: John B</title>
		<link>http://www.johnband.org/blog/2008/07/07/well-worth-the-license-fee/comment-page-1/#comment-49433</link>
		<dc:creator>John B</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jul 2008 10:43:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnband.org/blog/2008/07/07/well-worth-the-license-fee/#comment-49433</guid>
		<description>Duff - it doesn&#039;t matter in the slightest if 20 or even 40 kids a year die in stabbings; that&#039;s still so few that no individual kid has a serious chance of dying in a stabbing.

(in fact, you only have a serious chance of dying in a stabbing if you&#039;re a thug who starts a knife fight with another thug...)

I&#039;d be delighted to send a copy to Mrs Newlove, on the grounds that at the very least it would annoy the poisonous harpy a bit...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Duff &#8211; it doesn&#8217;t matter in the slightest if 20 or even 40 kids a year die in stabbings; that&#8217;s still so few that no individual kid has a serious chance of dying in a stabbing.</p>
<p>(in fact, you only have a serious chance of dying in a stabbing if you&#8217;re a thug who starts a knife fight with another thug&#8230;)</p>
<p>I&#8217;d be delighted to send a copy to Mrs Newlove, on the grounds that at the very least it would annoy the poisonous harpy a bit&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Banditry &#187; Blog Archive &#187; On why society is basically doomed</title>
		<link>http://www.johnband.org/blog/2008/07/07/well-worth-the-license-fee/comment-page-1/#comment-49432</link>
		<dc:creator>Banditry &#187; Blog Archive &#187; On why society is basically doomed</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jul 2008 10:41:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnband.org/blog/2008/07/07/well-worth-the-license-fee/#comment-49432</guid>
		<description>[...] Sunny has a good piece on Commentisfree on the knife panic - worth a read. Apparently the original version linked to this post here, but the Guardian subs took it out - bad Guardian subs. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Sunny has a good piece on Commentisfree on the knife panic &#8211; worth a read. Apparently the original version linked to this post here, but the Guardian subs took it out &#8211; bad Guardian subs. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Pickled Politics &#187; Knife crime &#8216;epidemic&#8217;</title>
		<link>http://www.johnband.org/blog/2008/07/07/well-worth-the-license-fee/comment-page-1/#comment-49355</link>
		<dc:creator>Pickled Politics &#187; Knife crime &#8216;epidemic&#8217;</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jul 2008 01:57:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnband.org/blog/2008/07/07/well-worth-the-license-fee/#comment-49355</guid>
		<description>[...] links off. I think that&#8217;s bad etiquette.    &#160; &#124; &#160; Trackback link &#160; &#124; &#160; Add to del.icio.us &#160; &#124; &#160; function fbs_click(){u=location.href;t=document.title;window.open(&#039;http://www.facebook.com/sharer.php?u=&#039;+encodeURIComponent(u)+&#039;&amp;t=&#039;+encodeURIComponent(t),&#039;sharer&#039;,&#039;toolbar=0,status=0,width=626,height=436&#039;);return false;}Share on Facebook &#160; &#124; &#160; Filed in: Civil liberties, Culture, Economics [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] links off. I think that&#8217;s bad etiquette.    &nbsp; | &nbsp; Trackback link &nbsp; | &nbsp; Add to del.icio.us &nbsp; | &nbsp; function fbs_click(){u=location.href;t=document.title;window.open(&#8217;http://www.facebook.com/sharer.php?u=&#8217;+encodeURIComponent(u)+&#8217;&#38;t=&#8217;+encodeURIComponent(t),&#8217;sharer&#8217;,'toolbar=0,status=0,width=626,height=436&#8242;);return false;}Share on Facebook &nbsp; | &nbsp; Filed in: Civil liberties, Culture, Economics [...]</p>
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		<title>By: David Duff</title>
		<link>http://www.johnband.org/blog/2008/07/07/well-worth-the-license-fee/comment-page-1/#comment-49087</link>
		<dc:creator>David Duff</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Jul 2008 17:07:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnband.org/blog/2008/07/07/well-worth-the-license-fee/#comment-49087</guid>
		<description>Thank you, Mr. Band, you have anticipated my request for another of your soothing essays in which my increasing worries can be calmed and stilled even as, night after night, Sky News (I mean, what&#039;s wrong with shooting the messenger?) keeps telling me of the death of more and more children from stabbings.  Nothing to worry about, as you assure us all in that kindly, avuncular Dr. Finlay (don&#039;t ask!) tone of voice.

You should send a copy to Mrs. Newlove, it&#039;ll be such a comfort, I&#039;m sure.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you, Mr. Band, you have anticipated my request for another of your soothing essays in which my increasing worries can be calmed and stilled even as, night after night, Sky News (I mean, what&#8217;s wrong with shooting the messenger?) keeps telling me of the death of more and more children from stabbings.  Nothing to worry about, as you assure us all in that kindly, avuncular Dr. Finlay (don&#8217;t ask!) tone of voice.</p>
<p>You should send a copy to Mrs. Newlove, it&#8217;ll be such a comfort, I&#8217;m sure.</p>
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		<title>By: John B</title>
		<link>http://www.johnband.org/blog/2008/07/07/well-worth-the-license-fee/comment-page-1/#comment-49030</link>
		<dc:creator>John B</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Jul 2008 10:23:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnband.org/blog/2008/07/07/well-worth-the-license-fee/#comment-49030</guid>
		<description>As the man says:

&lt;i&gt;It wouldn&#039;t matter if exaggerating the scale of the problem didn&#039;t make it more likely youngsters will seek to protect themselves with knives and the wider population will needlessly worry about what is a tiny risk for all but a few.&lt;/i&gt;

More generally, my &#039;studied complacency&#039; isn&#039;t in support of the government of my choice (if you think the current NHS-money-squandering, 42-days-interning, porn-banning, cannabis-upgrading, Iraq-war-supporting, Daily-Mail-appeasing lot would be the government of my choice, you really haven&#039;t been paying attention).

If it exists, which I&#039;d question, it&#039;s in support of the general principle that most public concerns (crime, the economy, immigration, terrorism) are far less severe than they appear, and that we&#039;d do far better in terms of aggregate public happiness if we worried about them less. 

Ultimately, even if making the public believe there was a terrible knife crime epidemic did save a few lives rather than making things worse (let&#039;s say it halved the annual rate of teen knife murder, saving about 15 lives), the harm done by making everyone believe things were unspeakably awful (hence scared to go out, spending on steel doors and stab-proof vests, avoiding living in cities or having kids) would be far greater than the good done by saving those lives. 

And if you don&#039;t think it&#039;s reasonable to trade off quality-of-life for a large group against life-and-death for a few individuals, you probably shouldn&#039;t be allowed to vote...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As the man says:</p>
<p><i>It wouldn&#8217;t matter if exaggerating the scale of the problem didn&#8217;t make it more likely youngsters will seek to protect themselves with knives and the wider population will needlessly worry about what is a tiny risk for all but a few.</i></p>
<p>More generally, my &#8217;studied complacency&#8217; isn&#8217;t in support of the government of my choice (if you think the current NHS-money-squandering, 42-days-interning, porn-banning, cannabis-upgrading, Iraq-war-supporting, Daily-Mail-appeasing lot would be the government of my choice, you really haven&#8217;t been paying attention).</p>
<p>If it exists, which I&#8217;d question, it&#8217;s in support of the general principle that most public concerns (crime, the economy, immigration, terrorism) are far less severe than they appear, and that we&#8217;d do far better in terms of aggregate public happiness if we worried about them less. </p>
<p>Ultimately, even if making the public believe there was a terrible knife crime epidemic did save a few lives rather than making things worse (let&#8217;s say it halved the annual rate of teen knife murder, saving about 15 lives), the harm done by making everyone believe things were unspeakably awful (hence scared to go out, spending on steel doors and stab-proof vests, avoiding living in cities or having kids) would be far greater than the good done by saving those lives. </p>
<p>And if you don&#8217;t think it&#8217;s reasonable to trade off quality-of-life for a large group against life-and-death for a few individuals, you probably shouldn&#8217;t be allowed to vote&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Peter Risdon</title>
		<link>http://www.johnband.org/blog/2008/07/07/well-worth-the-license-fee/comment-page-1/#comment-48907</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter Risdon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Jul 2008 14:45:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnband.org/blog/2008/07/07/well-worth-the-license-fee/#comment-48907</guid>
		<description>John, that blog post contains the following: &quot;injuries from stabbings have gone up in England - particularly in London.&quot; and in an update adds: &quot;By my calculations, knife crime has risen three times faster in London over the past five years than the rest of England. This, I think, demonstrates how the situation in the capital has driven the claims of an epidemic.&quot;

Your post gives no hint of that. Surely dead children are too high a price to pay for studied political complacency in support of the government of one&#039;s choice? This isn&#039;t the first time I&#039;ve picked up this kind of omission in your posts.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>John, that blog post contains the following: &#8220;injuries from stabbings have gone up in England &#8211; particularly in London.&#8221; and in an update adds: &#8220;By my calculations, knife crime has risen three times faster in London over the past five years than the rest of England. This, I think, demonstrates how the situation in the capital has driven the claims of an epidemic.&#8221;</p>
<p>Your post gives no hint of that. Surely dead children are too high a price to pay for studied political complacency in support of the government of one&#8217;s choice? This isn&#8217;t the first time I&#8217;ve picked up this kind of omission in your posts.</p>
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		<title>By: John B</title>
		<link>http://www.johnband.org/blog/2008/07/07/well-worth-the-license-fee/comment-page-1/#comment-48895</link>
		<dc:creator>John B</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 08 Jul 2008 13:34:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.johnband.org/blog/2008/07/07/well-worth-the-license-fee/#comment-48895</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ve now added &quot;pointed hyperbole&quot; tags for the ease of the casual reader. 

But yes, I genuinely believe that, given the negligible impact that crime (rather than the irrational fear of crime) has on most people&#039;s lives, the human waste (and, less importantly, the money waste) on imprisoning people and writing them off as members of society is totally ridiculous.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve now added &#8220;pointed hyperbole&#8221; tags for the ease of the casual reader. </p>
<p>But yes, I genuinely believe that, given the negligible impact that crime (rather than the irrational fear of crime) has on most people&#8217;s lives, the human waste (and, less importantly, the money waste) on imprisoning people and writing them off as members of society is totally ridiculous.</p>
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